Speaking dialect has its uses
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Mar 22, 2011 - ST Forum
WRITER Chong Zi Liang said he could not take part in conversations with 50-year-old members of his extended family because he could not speak Cantonese, which prevented him from bonding with them ("Confessions of a Canto flop"; last Saturday). He was also unable to order roast duck in a Cantonese restaurant in New York.
These are really the least of our Chinese language worries.
In 30 years' time, Cantonese will be extinct in Singapore. We are allowing a beautiful language to die in Singapore.
Listen to a pop song that is sung in Cantonese, then in Mandarin, and you can hear the difference.The Cantonese version sounds so elegant and sonorous, the Mandarin one, clinical and flat.
When I visited Shantou last year, it was joyous to hear my mother tongue, Teochew, spoken everywhere. It was such a culturally enriching experience. Street life was just that much more colourful, because of the use of that language.
The death of the major Chinese dialects here (Cantonese, Teochew, Hokkien, Hainanese) would mean their respective operas would be dead here too.
A big part of our collective culture is dying.
Chia Buk Chua
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we wont lose the dialects as long as we continue to use it. knn singaporeans should wake up. dont do everything just based on its economic benefits.
if you want to only speak english and english only then move to US and UK and be one of them.
as if they'll consider you one of them...
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hokkien won't die though.. it's a de-facto 2nd language during NS...
the 1st language being foul language
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TS
I heard two foreign students from China speaking Teochew here in Sg. It hit me. I think I never heard Teochew in its pure tongue since my childhood where I heard old ladies spoke them.
All our dialects are mixture of this and that. Don't think we can hear or get back to dialects in their pure form anymore.
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Originally posted by 4sg:
TS
I heard two foreign students from China speaking Teochew here in Sg. It hit me. I think I never heard Teochew in its pure tongue since my childhood where I heard old ladies spoke them.
All our dialects are mixture of this and that. Don't think we can hear or get back to dialects in their pure form anymore.
At least the old ladies are original... unlike those aunties in their 30s who cant speak English well, and speak those lousy sounding Singlish..... to their children.
Example:
"There, there, Jason, there the monkey over there, that one is monkey..."
instead of (That's the orang utan.)
WTF is this language? Even Singlish oso fail. -
how sad indeed to see the different chinese languages becoming extinct in SG...
to be technically correct, i read somewhere in the past that the mandarin that we now speak and learn in schools originates as a court language in beijing... the other so called dialects are just as authentic as any languages, and not a variant of mandarin...
i also saw this book in the national geographic shop at viviocity sometime back which talks about dying languages around the world, and how we are in danger of losing entire cultures, different worldviews, religious views etc. which are contained in the language words and grammer...
don't let these languages die out in SG... the experiences of young children will be much "poorer" when that happens
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Originally posted by dragg:
we wont lose the dialects as long as we continue to use it. knn singaporeans should wake up. dont do everything just based on its economic benefits.
if you want to only speak english and english only then move to US and UK and be one of them.
as if they'll consider you one of them...
Its our MM Lee who doesn't want us to use dialects, as it doesn't reap economic benefits lor.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/413581/1/.html
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Cantonese, in fact, has actually has been given the status of a language months back.
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Gahment should start a save dialect campaign.
Dialects are national heritage leh.
PAP obsessed with promoting English and chinese only.
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FT using dialects instead. Just board the bus, you hear weird weird dialects.
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Originally posted by Junyang700:
FT using dialects instead. Just board the bus, you hear weird weird dialects.
Shanghai dialects and hainanese dialects.I always hear.
Many PRCs migrate to Spore mah.
My flat got one professor his chinese accent bring from hometown, talk in high pitch tone.
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Originally posted by Singapore AFOL:
Shanghai dialects and hainanese dialects.I always hear.
Many PRCs migrate to Spore mah.
My flat got one professor his chinese accent bring from hometown, talk in high pitch tone.
Shandong one is it?
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Originally posted by Junyang700:
Shandong one is it?
yah lah. He very tall. -
Originally posted by Singapore AFOL:
yah lah. He very tall.Cannot stand Shandong Mandarin, very irritating. -_-"
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Originally posted by Clivebenss:
Mar 22, 2011 - ST Forum
WRITER Chong Zi Liang said he could not take part in conversations with 50-year-old members of his extended family because he could not speak Cantonese, which prevented him from bonding with them ("Confessions of a Canto flop"; last Saturday). He was also unable to order roast duck in a Cantonese restaurant in New York.
These are really the least of our Chinese language worries.
In 30 years' time, Cantonese will be extinct in Singapore. We are allowing a beautiful language to die in Singapore.
Listen to a pop song that is sung in Cantonese, then in Mandarin, and you can hear the difference.The Cantonese version sounds so elegant and sonorous, the Mandarin one, clinical and flat.
When I visited Shantou last year, it was joyous to hear my mother tongue, Teochew, spoken everywhere. It was such a culturally enriching experience. Street life was just that much more colourful, because of the use of that language.
The death of the major Chinese dialects here (Cantonese, Teochew, Hokkien, Hainanese) would mean their respective operas would be dead here too.
A big part of our collective culture is dying.
Chia Buk Chua
Revive the dialect threads when you are free.
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Originally posted by dragg:
we wont lose the dialects as long as we continue to use it. knn singaporeans should wake up. dont do everything just based on its economic benefits.
if you want to only speak english and english only then move to US and UK and be one of them.
as if they'll consider you one of them...
Although some people are still using the dialects now, I would say they are neither the same as the current corresponding dialect at China side nor the same as they were when they first implanted here by our ancestor.
Singapore dialects has become a different breed altogether, so no point reviving by learning from China directly, I feel it's better for it to be passed down from our own native people (rather than learning from Cantonese movies or Taiwanese Hokkien shows with their non-Singaporean accents and usage).
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Originally posted by the Bear:
hokkien won't die though.. it's a de-facto 2nd language during NS...
the 1st language being foul language
Although the sounds of Hokkien is still heard, the vocabulary is much deteriorated, so actually Hokkien is already dying.
When talking to people around me, they can't even say the Hokkien words for eg.: "claws", "ladel" (of course a lot more, but recently these people intrigued me recently with their inability to say these common words)
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Originally posted by 4sg:
TS
I heard two foreign students from China speaking Teochew here in Sg. It hit me. I think I never heard Teochew in its pure tongue since my childhood where I heard old ladies spoke them.
All our dialects are mixture of this and that. Don't think we can hear or get back to dialects in their pure form anymore.
The Teochew spoken in China is only "pure" in it's pronunciation only. It's grammatical structure is highly deteriorated by Mandarin Chinese already. A lot of people dunno so just by basing on the sounds, we think it sounds pure.
Source added: http://www.sgforums.com/forums/8/topics/399157?page=3#post_9788098
a preface of a Chaozhou dictionary published in 2009 shows that Chaozhou kids below 12 years of age now speak an artificial Chaozhou dialect whose grammar is based heavily on Mandarin
^^^ direct quote from the preface:
" 一直以來，我å°�潮汕地å�€å°�å¸ç”Ÿæ½®å·žè©±èªžè¨€èƒ½åŠ›çš„退化深以爲慮。æ�®äº†è§£ï¼Œç›®å‰�潮汕地å�€æœ‰éƒ¨åˆ†å°�å¸ç”Ÿåœ¨å¸æ ¡è£�是è�¼ä¸�到也ä¸�能講潮州話的，由æ¤å¸¶ä¾†çš„å•�題是，相當部分的潮汕å°�å¸ç”Ÿä¸�會講準確ã€�æµ�利而å�ˆç”Ÿå‹•çš„潮州話å�£èªžï¼Œè€Œå�ªæœƒæ‹—è‘—å�£ï¼Œç”¨æ½®å·žè©±çš„讀音念著既åƒ�是普通話書é�¢èªžè€Œå�ˆå¤¾é›œè‘—潮州話特點的å�Šæ–‡ä¸�白的毫無生氣的“硬诔的書é�¢æ½®å·žè©±ï¼Œã€‚。。" -
Originally posted by coffeebreak:
how sad indeed to see the different chinese languages becoming extinct in SG...
to be technically correct, i read somewhere in the past that the mandarin that we now speak and learn in schools originates as a court language in beijing... the other so called dialects are just as authentic as any languages, and not a variant of mandarin...
i also saw this book in the national geographic shop at viviocity sometime back which talks about dying languages around the world, and how we are in danger of losing entire cultures, different worldviews, religious views etc. which are contained in the language words and grammer...
don't let these languages die out in SG... the experiences of young children will be much "poorer" when that happens
Ya actually all languages are dialects of some mother languages, it's always Political aspect to determine which language become official which languages becomes dialects (sub-status). Therefore, there is no such thing as one language "higher" than the other one.
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Originally posted by Junyang700:
Cantonese, in fact, has actually has been given the status of a language months back.
Good info. Got source?
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Originally posted by Singapore AFOL:
Gahment should start a save dialect campaign.
Dialects are national heritage leh.
PAP obsessed with promoting English and chinese only.
Can suggest a rough framework how to save dialect campaign?
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Originally posted by ditzy:
Its our MM Lee who doesn't want us to use dialects, as it doesn't reap economic benefits lor.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/413581/1/.html
Yes. In many countries, the purpose of reducing languages is as simple as reducing cost to publish materials in many languages, reducing cost in signages in many languages, reducing cost in official documents in many languages, reducing cost in education to hire and train and support the education in many languages , reducing cost in media to open TV channels, radio broadcasts, and newspapers in many languages
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far too gone, dialects are systematically dismantled in Sg unless those young ones have strong parents that insist on passing down their heritage. That the price we paid for believing and trusting someone everything he said.
his mistake, your rootlessness.
Sorry if this offend anyone.
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Originally posted by Junyang700:
Cantonese, in fact, has actually has been given the status of a language months back.
In fact everywhere you go if you can speak Cantonese it is a big advantage.
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Originally posted by BanguIzai:
The Teochew spoken in China is only "pure" in it's pronunciation only. It's grammatical structure is highly deteriorated by Mandarin Chinese already. A lot of people dunno so just by basing on the sounds, we think it sounds pure.
Source added: http://www.sgforums.com/forums/8/topics/399157?page=3#post_9788098
Maybe what you said is true. But China is a big country and I believe there are still pockets of dialect speaking people there who can communicate dialects in their pure forms.The Teochew I heard from these two China students was indeed in its pure form - not diluted with Mandarin. I know because I wasn't eavesdropping but with them and heard them spoke Teochew among themselves for a long time in its pure form - a rarity I never encounter for a long time.