Was this pastor right or wrong ?
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in his last sun's morning preach, he said things that supported israel's stand aganist palestine and in many preachings, he made negative comments abt palestine and i feel he probably trying to tell us palestinians are bad ?
anyway he made a comparision between hitler and some other evil person in dunno where and another comparison between JFK and another president.
there are quite a few factual errors he made.
first JFK wasnt shot in a warehouse, he was shot on an open road in a Lincoln
his killers werent caught,( not sure abt this)
hitler wasnt gay, his second in command (or something) was gay. in fact he married his love in an underground bunker in the final days leading to the end of war.
how can a pastor make so many factual errors ?
and i feel alot of his comparisons are rubbish. like the car JFK used was a Lincoln, at that time, Lincoln was the car of choice. just like benz is now. -
which church?
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If what u said is true, he didn't do his homework.Originally posted by bismarck:in his last sun's morning preach, he said things that supported israel's stand aganist palestine and in many preachings, he made negative comments abt palestine and i feel he probably trying to tell us palestinians are bad ?
anyway he made a comparision between hitler and some other evil person in dunno where and another comparison between JFK and another president.
there are quite a few factual errors he made.
first JFK wasnt shot in a warehouse, he was shot on an open road in a Lincoln
his killers werent caught,( not sure abt this)
hitler wasnt gay, his second in command (or something) was gay. in fact he married his love in an underground bunker in the final days leading to the end of war.
how can a pastor make so many factual errors ?
and i feel alot of his comparisons are rubbish. like the car JFK used was a Lincoln, at that time, Lincoln was the car of choice. just like benz is now. -
i can attest to both errors because i saw the documentary from reputed sources and they have a damn big rep to protectOriginally posted by worried99:If what u said is true, he didn't do his homework.
Discovery channel for the JFK thing, (btw the documentary was damn exhaustive and long)
Hilter: Rise of evil for the gay comment -
which church is it?Originally posted by bismarck:i can attest to both errors because i saw the documentary from reputed sources and they have a damn big rep to protect
Discovery channel for the JFK thing, (btw the documentary was damn exhaustive and long)
Hilter: Rise of evil for the gay comment -
Ignore the dumb pastor.... getting the white collar does not make a man wise... just supposedly more learned.
Pulpit teaching - take it with a pinch of salt and derive your own conclusion - make use of the wisdom given to you by God.
Pastors are still human who are given to their personal preference and biaseness.
Once my pastor said something to the effect: "...as Christians we must be free from the 4Cs - Cash, Cars, Credit Cards and Condoms...."
Tried very hard not to laugh..... -
hitler married eva braun just before his own supposed suicide... but there are many theories that he was a closet homosexual...
as for the Palestinians, dig up their history yourself.... and see that the whole mess is covered in blood.... and that that Palestinians have basically been politically screwed by their own "president" Arafat...
dig further and find that he stands to lose his monopoly on trade in the occupied territories and all that if there was peace.. see that his family is living in luxury in France while he extorts his "breathern" to commit atrocities... see that he is not even a "Palestinian" but an Egyptian... learn about all the crimes that Arafat has committed or has been linked to... including the Munich Olympic murders, the Achille Lauro... and check out his billions stashed away, misappropriated from the funds that were supposed to be aid for the Palestinians...
and one article you must not leave out.. from here => Interview with PLO exco Zahir Muhsein- Way back on March 31, 1977, the Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with Palestine Liberation Organization executive committee member Zahir Muhsein. Here's what he said:
The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.
For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.
then go dig up the dirt on the Israelis and how they themselves used terror tactics... but it must be said that they have actually pursued peace until Arafat's walking out of the talks and launching his Intifadah when Israel, under Ehud Barak gave everything the Palestinians demanded except total control of Jerusalem (to be negotiated) for peace...
since then, there has been a state of total chaos..
read the history books and trawl the internet (stay away from the nutters' sites tho' )... -
About the issue on palestinian, maybe u can try to post it on politics forum.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=76376&page=0
Instead of seeing things one sided, it may be wise to read up on both side of the argument. -
It is not unusual for a protestant pastor to bad mouth other religions or hold anti-catholism or racist remarks.
We must pray for them to be free from judgemental attitude -
pastors are human too...
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He who judged will in turn be judged.
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if u here to sow discords..then pls leave.Originally posted by sliew:It is not unusual for a protestant pastor to bad mouth other religions or hold anti-catholism or racist remarks.
We must pray for them to be free from judgemental attitude
we discuss things here by God's Word. no personal idea and prejudice -
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Bimarck,
what u can do it this.
1) Discuss it with another knowledgeable church friend. Then when both are agreeable, go together and talk to the pastor nicely. Give the pastor some time to reply. After some time, if pastor not reply you both, then go n inform the higher authority lor.
2) If all in authority are in cohoot, what I can say is this:
whatever people say, we just take only those we feel is right. We don't follow what we feel is wrong
Yes, pastor may tell u to follow entirely, but a pastor is not God. Pastor only a representative. So he/she can be wrong.
BTW, I am not from any Church. -
Neon, respecfully, I don't think that sliew is trying to sow discord here. He was just expressing his personal observation.Originally posted by NeonTetra:if u here to sow discords..then pls leave.
we discuss things here by God's Word. no personal idea and prejudice
I have been accused of trying to sow discord too, when I post comments on the city church and it's leadership.
Having said all that, there are other smart people who incessantly post arguments and counter-arguments about the Christian doctrine and plain refuse to accept (not necessarily agree with) other people's view. -
Always listen with a discerning heart. Pray for the Holy Spirit to guide you as you listen.
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ok sureOriginally posted by Chin Eng:Neon, respecfully, I don't think that sliew is trying to sow discord here. He was just expressing his personal observation.
I have been accused of trying to sow discord too, when I post comments on the city church and it's leadership.
Having said all that, there are other smart people who incessantly post arguments and counter-arguments about the Christian doctrine and plain refuse to accept (not necessarily agree with) other people's view.
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i cant comment abt the palestinian thing because i am not terribly interested in the arab world.the reason why i brought it up was because the pastor branded not just the palestinians but other religions etc as the bad party, whether they are wrong or not. sort of like, blanket views.
just that he seems to like preach 'the wrongdoings" and that his examples are quoted from the bible and to me, it's sort of his story only. -
i agree.Originally posted by Chin Eng:Neon, respecfully, I don't think that sliew is trying to sow discord here. He was just expressing his personal observation.
I have been accused of trying to sow discord too, when I post comments on the city church and it's leadership.
Having said all that, there are other smart people who incessantly post arguments and counter-arguments about the Christian doctrine and plain refuse to accept (not necessarily agree with) other people's view. -
the last thing i want to say, which may bear only slight relations to this matter, once another pastor received an email or something that sort of disagreed with him or something(i cant remember the exact event) but that pastor i am talking abt in my first post, made very sarcastic comments abt that letter.
plus, he frequently made references to his state of wealth. frequently mentioned that his dad-in-law is rich and went on frequently holidays(besides the usual official church affair trips)
anyway i think i will let this matter rest, i feel i can make my own decisions whether to believe him or not.
thanks guys
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all this sounds very familiar ...... 4th July rings a bell? I remember hearing this too & walking out feeling a lil lost & confused, very uncharacteristic totally off-kilter IMO.Originally posted by bismarck:in his last sun's morning preach, he said things that supported israel's stand aganist palestine and in many preachings, he made negative comments abt palestine and i feel he probably trying to tell us palestinians are bad ?
anyway he made a comparision between hitler and some other evil person in dunno where and another comparison between JFK and another president.
there are quite a few factual errors he made.
first JFK wasnt shot in a warehouse, he was shot on an open road in a Lincoln
his killers werent caught,( not sure abt this)
hitler wasnt gay, his second in command (or something) was gay. in fact he married his love in an underground bunker in the final days leading to the end of war.
how can a pastor make so many factual errors ?
and i feel alot of his comparisons are rubbish. like the car JFK used was a Lincoln, at that time, Lincoln was the car of choice. just like benz is now.
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Neon, respecfully, I don't think that sliew is trying to sow discord here. He was just expressing his personal observation.
During a debate, it is necessary to know tat your role is to let the other people accept your viewpoint while the other party role is to let u accept theirs. When suggesting other people have a problem of accepting your viewpoint, it may be worthwhile to notice sometimes they themselves too have fail to accept the viewpoint of others. It goes 2 ways.
I have been accused of trying to sow discord too, when I post comments on the city church and it's leadership.
Having said all that, there are other smart people who incessantly post arguments and counter-arguments about the Christian doctrine and plain refuse to accept (not necessarily agree with) other people's view. -
i hope i am not sounding like an arrogant idiot but if it sounded familiar, we have the same church in mind.Originally posted by True_Xerion:all this sounds very familiar ...... 4th July rings a bell? I remember hearing this too & walking out feeling a lil lost & confused, very uncharacteristic totally off-kilter IMO. -
Nope you are not in one bit arrogant or wrong to point all these out. Although to be frank, I would say I will not say what he say is wrong or right because I did not know his motives, his references, his interpretations. Pastors are pretty much human and they are also subjected to interpretations. So I guess I had my fair share of controversial interpretations and preaching from my pastors and even from myself hahaha....but I guess the best example the bible gave us were the BEREANS who consulted the scriptures despite hearing preachings from PAUL, the great apostle, I think thats the attitude we should maintain. To always c heck with God hehehe
here s the verse.
Acts 17:11
Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. -
i'm quite sure it's the same one we attendOriginally posted by bismarck:i hope i am not sounding like an arrogant idiot but if it sounded familiar, we have the same church in mind.
usually he makes a lot of sense & is able to very clearly convey his message but i do agree that particular sermon was rather odd, drawing upon inferences made on shaky ground & some 'conspiracy theory' ideas?
btw which one u go to? we usually go for 4th .....
TX