City Harvest Church under investigation by CAD and CoC
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Originally posted by hasene:
Where money is concerned I wonder how Catholics get it without going round preaching prosperity sermon to "con" believers for money. All i know from a catholic friend is the money is from a central pool, is this true, any Catholics here to verify?
Yes , this true. We also don't go around asking people to donate $$$. During mass, the priest will usually talk about issues which are related to our lives and teach us on how to live gracefully without sins. There is no mention about $$$ at all even during offering time. During offering time, the priest will sit down while collectors walk around the church collecting $ from those who want to donate. The only time when a catholic church talks about $ is when they want to raise funds to renovate the church or when they want us to donate to the Catholic Welfare Service which offers financial help to the poor and this only happens once a year during Easter.Contrary to CHC's Kong Hee , Catholic priests tell us that Jesus was born poor not RICH and they always tell us to live humbly like God and advise us not to be obsesed with material wealth . This is why I feel very comfortable in a Catholic Church although I must admit that I find most of the masses to be very boring and they have failed to create a youth group to retain more youths in the church . That is why some Catholic youths have joined CHC and other megachurches.
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Originally posted by hasene:
For your info, christian churches don't need and don't have nuns preparing and obtaining permission from archbishop for Holy Communion. Christianity does not have any nuns. I think you got confused with catholism.
Anglican , Methodist and other Christian denominations usually have someone with higher authority to regulate the churches and their actions which is similar to Catholism. Hence, these churches are usually very organised and will not go astray so easily. However, CHC and other megachurches don't have anyone controlling them so they can do whatever they like . Hence ,the government has to step in when things go out of hand.Christian organizations whether they are Anglican or Catholic usually build old folks' home or hospitals to help and contribute back to the society.Some Methodist churches also run programmes to help gambling addicts quit their bad habits. The same can be said for other religious organisations like Buddhism. But what have CHC and NCC done? Have they done anything to contribute back to the society? They are more interested in expanding their churches and taking over shopping malls .LOL
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Originally posted by montana222:
New Creation Church and Joseph Prince. I wonder whether FCBC is preaching the prosperity gospel since it is able to attract a strong congregation of about 9000+ members?Last time, I got one'' friend ''who was originally from CHC but switched to FCBC later on and he kept pestering me to go to his fcbc church even though I was attending mass at a catholic church.This ''friend ''damn CB one....got one time I met him for lunch after his FCBC service and he insisted on going to botak jones to eat. After he had ordered the food, he said that he got no money to pay for the food cos he donated the $$$ to church... so I bo bian had to lend him some $$$. Sometimes, I find that ''lost sheeps'' tend to flock to megachurches since megachurches only preach about the positive things and these gong kia will then donate most of their $$ to their church.
I laughed at my stupid ''friend'' for donating of all his $$$ to his pastor and while the pastor is dining at a restaurant in a 5 star hotel, he got no money to eat at botak jones. LOL
Where can one find a catholic with a chee bye mouth like yours? You are a fake. A sockpuppet!
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Originally posted by montana222:
Anglican , Methodist and other Christian denominations usually have someone with higher authority to regulate the churches and their actions which is similar to Catholism. Hence, these churches are usually very organised and will not go astray so easily. However, CHC and other megachurches don't have anyone controlling them so they can do whatever they like . Hence ,the government has to step in when things go out of hand.Christian organizations whether they are Anglican or Catholic usually build old folks' home or hospitals to help and contribute back to the society.Some Methodist churches also run programmes to help gambling addicts quit their bad habits. The same can be said for other religious organisations like Buddhism. But what have CHC and NCC done? Have they done anything to contribute back to the society? They are more interested in expanding their churches and taking over shopping malls .LOL
I know the link among the catholic, anglican and methodist churchs. Anglicans broken away from Catholicism and Methodists broken away from Anglican. That explains some of their practices are the same. Methodists do practise infant baptism and observe advent, Ash Wednesday and so on. There is archbishop in methodist denomination.
CHC is modern church. I am not sure who they are accountable to.
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Originally posted by googoomuck:
Where can one find a catholic with a chee bye mouth like yours? You are a fake. A sockpuppet!
HELLO! Everyone commit sins .Don't tell me you are a very good christian/buddhist/muslim and have never committed any sin. People sin tats why need religion.LOL -
sins are all too human; without sins, where the need for holiness?
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Originally posted by hasene:
For your info, christian churches don't need and don't have nuns preparing and obtaining permission from archbishop for Holy Communion. Christianity does not have any nuns. I think you got confused with catholism.Catholics not christians? Then how about Anglican, Medthodist, Presbeyterian...etc..
And what about those "mega-churches" that are running into trouble with CAD and ISD? Are they christians churches?
What will make one a christian church? I am confused....
Maybe, these "mega-churches" are not christians churches after all? They do not preach the Gospel according to the main stream churches and most (if not all) main streams churches seems to reject their teachings. They have their own brand of gosepl called "prosperity gospel" which no main stream churches are preaching.
Also, most (if not all) main stream churches do not ask for tithes like these mega churches do.....and most main streams churches' priests and pastors are certainly not rich like those from "mega-churches". They are not in the church for money....but still, most churches are actually rich.
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Originally posted by Tehtarlek:
Catholics not christians? Then how about Anglican, Medthodist, Presbeyterian...etc..
And what about those "mega-churches" that are running into trouble with CAD and ISD? Are they christians churches?
What will make one a christian church? I am confused....
Maybe, these "mega-churches" are not christians churches after all? They do not preach the Gospel according to the main stream churches and most (if not all) main streams churches seems to reject their teachings. They have their own brand of gosepl called "prosperity gospel" which no main stream churches are preaching.
Also, most (if not all) main stream churches do not ask for tithes like these mega churches do.....and most main streams churches' priests and pastors are certainly not rich like those from "mega-churches". They are not in the church for money....but still, most churches are actually rich.
Catholics, Protestants and Eastern Orthodox are all Christians.The "Christians" that we normally talk about especially in local context are actually the Protestants whose "ancestors" (I'm talking only about the main stream ones) broke away from the Catholics because they "protested" against the Catholic Church and her Pope.
The Protestants never like to be called protestants. They are never seem to be proud of this name. I guess that's why they only want to be called Christians.
Frankly, I dunno why forming "mega-churches" is never discouraged by the mainstreamers. There is no reason to create a new church organisation unless one wants to have his own followers (wants to be a Jesus).
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too bad NCC is not listed on stock exchange ah !
price will drop due to CHC scandal then when CHC bites the dust and their mindless goons join NCC, the stock price will sky-rocket !
aiyah, the biggest scammers are in the Vatican lah, NCC and CHC small peanuts only.
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the term 'christians' seem to be misinterpreted these days. All believers in Christ are christians, that includes catholics, methodists, jesuits, protestants etc. Not just CHC or NCC type of churches.
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Originally posted by Rock^Star:
the term 'christians' seem to be misinterpreted these days. All believers in Christ are christians, that includes catholics, methodists, jesuits, protestants etc. Not just CHC or NCC type of churches.
because every pastor of these megachurches want to present themselves as a) messiah b) true rep of christ c) great leader
and every believer in those churches (hate to even call them xtians) want to think their church is one true church
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Originally posted by googoomuck:
Where can one find a catholic with a chee bye mouth like yours? You are a fake. A sockpuppet!
what's with the vulgarity? If you have nothing good or constructive to add in this thread....shut up for goodness sake!
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Originally posted by de_middle:
what's with the vulgarity? If you have nothing good or constructive to add in this thread....shut up for goodness sake!
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Originally posted by Tehtarlek:
Catholics not christians? Then how about Anglican, Medthodist, Presbeyterian...etc..
And what about those "mega-churches" that are running into trouble with CAD and ISD? Are they christians churches?
What will make one a christian church? I am confused....
Maybe, these "mega-churches" are not christians churches after all? They do not preach the Gospel according to the main stream churches and most (if not all) main streams churches seems to reject their teachings. They have their own brand of gosepl called "prosperity gospel" which no main stream churches are preaching.
Also, most (if not all) main stream churches do not ask for tithes like these mega churches do.....and most main streams churches' priests and pastors are certainly not rich like those from "mega-churches". They are not in the church for money....but still, most churches are actually rich.
What I am going to say is what I know from the church history does not necessarily represent my stand. In the beginning they are worshipping one God and there came a time some of those worshipping God went side track to worship God and others and thus some broke away from this and they called themselves christians. This is how Catholics label christians as protestants, this sound pretty unkind.
You can ask 24/7 and despondent to see what they say.
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May i ask ? How come they have to pass a bag and ask for donation every week ? Whats the money for ? And i saw people donating $50 and more.. if lets say each person $2 thats quite alot of money from everyone. Building new church ? Impossible rite? My friend from the church say they have to raise fund. But for what ? The most they only buy candle for you nia.
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Originally posted by LaMutha:
May i ask ? How come they have to pass a bag and ask for donation every week ? Whats the money for ? And i saw people donating $50 and more.. if lets say each person $2 thats quite alot of money from everyone. Building new church ? Impossible rite? My friend from the church say they have to raise fund. But for what ? The most they only buy candle for you nia.
Basically there are 2 kinds of donations in the catholic church. One is for funds that are required to help the church maintain its expenses. These funds can also be used if the church requires major restoration works.
If these funds are not enough, they might have to do a donation drive if there is a major restoration work or even building a new church like Divine Mercy....i do know that when St Stephen had their restoration, they were so short of funds that contribution had to come from other churches as well....
The other donation that happens only on every 1st sunday of the month goes to helping the poor staying in the vicinity of the church. In the catholic church, there is no compelling force in donating. Give if you can & somewhere in the bible...Jesus did say this "the least you do unto my brothers, you do unto me"
Can someone correct me if there is a mistake in my quote, thank you....
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Originally posted by laurence82:
because every pastor of these megachurches want to present themselves as a) messiah b) true rep of christ c) great leader
and every believer in those churches (hate to even call them xtians) want to think their church is one true church
Then these ''Christians'' NSFs attending CHC will say that they cannot perform guard duty on Christmas day or Good Friday cause need to help Kong Hee to raise more funds during the Easter food and funfair. -
Originally posted by hasene:
What I am going to say is what I know from the church history does not necessarily represent my stand. In the beginning they are worshipping one God and there came a time some of those worshipping God went side track to worship God and others and thus some broke away from this and they called themselves christians. This is how Catholics label christians as protestants, this sound pretty unkind.
You can ask 24/7 and despondent to see what they say.
Not worship God and others lah...The Reformers at that was coined Protestants because they were protesting against the practices of the church, namely the selling of indulgences . Because of this protest, and insubordination to the Pope, they were ex-communicated.
Ironically, this practice was subsequently banned by Pope Pius approx. 50years after the breakaway in 1567.
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indulgence
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Originally posted by vince69:
Not worship God and others lah...The Reformers at that was coined Protestants because they were protesting against the practices of the church, namely the selling of indulgences . Because of this protest, and insubordination to the Pope, they were ex-communicated.
Ironically, this practice was subsequently banned by Pope Pius approx. 50years after the breakaway in 1567.
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indulgence
Up to you. -
Originally posted by de_middle:
Basically there are 2 kinds of donations in the catholic church. One is for funds that are required to help the church maintain its expenses. These funds can also be used if the church requires major restoration works.
If these funds are not enough, they might have to do a donation drive if there is a major restoration work or even building a new church like Divine Mercy....i do know that when St Stephen had their restoration, they were so short of funds that contribution had to come from other churches as well....
The other donation that happens only on every 1st sunday of the month goes to helping the poor staying in the vicinity of the church. In the catholic church, there is no compelling force in donating. Give if you can & somewhere in the bible...Jesus did say this "the least you do unto my brothers, you do unto me"
Can someone correct me if there is a mistake in my quote, thank you....
Two types of collection. One is tithes and the other is offering.
Tithes is giving 10% of the salary as stated in the bible. Offering is collected for donation to charity or whatever.
Churches preaching the prosperity theory/gospel ask for more money than these. Greed is in control.
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Originally posted by hasene:
Two types of collection. One is tithes and the other is offering.
Tithes is giving 10% of the salary as stated in the bible. Offering is collected for donation to charity or whatever.
Churches preaching the prosperity theory/gospel ask for more money than these. Greed is in control.
not in the catholic church....which is why the bag is normally passed around.
perhaps u would like to know there are indeed very poor catholic churches in s'pore....
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Originally posted by de_middle:
not in the catholic church....which is why the bag is normally passed around.
perhaps u would like to know there are indeed very poor catholic churches in s'pore....
The christian churches practise the same, pass bags around.I believe there are poor catholic churches in Singapore. If you don't mind , would you tell us which are the ones. I prefer to visit Catholic Churches, long time did not go to any Catholic church.
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St Stevens church..last time I went there super run down. Good some more, Mass very fast ends
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Originally posted by hasene:
The christian churches practise the same, pass bags around.I believe there are poor catholic churches in Singapore. If you don't mind , would you tell us which are the ones. I prefer to visit Catholic Churches, long time did not go to any Catholic church.
if u like, please go to St Stephen which is somewhere in Aljunied area. The population for that church is small which results in very low level of contributions received. As such, they had to seek help from other catholic churches to fund the renovation works.
priests receives only an allowance & anything extra normally comes from solemnizing weddings or during chinese new year where fellow catholics will give them ang pows....
they are nothing like pastors, with no fancy cars or houses....its total giving having to spend 7 or more years studying to be a priest & spending rest of their lives giving service to the catholic community...
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Originally posted by small-man:
St Stevens church..last time I went there super run down. Good some more, Mass very fast ends
Is this St Stephens , the one near Aljunied HDB flats?