Sufferings
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Originally posted by Icemoon:yah lor .. even Jesus suffered only 3 years out of 33 years.
if you are strict, 1 week.
if you are stricter, few hours.
if you are strictest .. only at that particular moment of crucification.
I didn't mean that leh. -
I know.Originally posted by M©+square: I didn't mean that leh.
But I make sense or not .. even Jesus only suffered for three years at most. -
not really so, suffering is good cos it can lead a person to grow MORE spiritually, or MORE than other ppl.
Tat is a very abstract answer. Wat do u mean by "growing spiritually" ? If u wanna grow more spiritually, then why don't u inflict pain onto yourself such as cutting off your feet or somethingSuffering exists so that one is able to differenciate in between a situation where theres no suffering and a situation where there is. We wld be happy or satisfied with our lives when we WERE in a suffering state and later NOT.
If there is no suffering, is there ever a need to understand suffering watsoever ? -
wah .. SIS is so hardworking even at this hour?
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Oh wow... I forgot it is 3 am in singapore already
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Ok, but only because you asked....Originally posted by stupidissmart:Fair enough, then can u explain wat is your interpretation of the genesis 3:14-19 using an analogical approach
If my POV that for most parts, especially in the early records of Genesis is to be taken as an analogy or a parable, then that conversation may not have taken place literally. If it is going to interest you, I am not one of those who believe that creation took place in 6-24 hr days.... but this is just my personal view. In any case, I don't see it as holding a conflicting view of the Bible. There are many parts of the Bible that is written as analogies and Jesus Himself told many parables to illustrate specific points.
This is simple. Punishment is something that someone inflicts upon oneself, suffering is what one feels. Obviously, in many cases, punishment can result to suffering. However one need to understand that there are cases where there is suffering but no punishment, and vice versa. At the end of the day, the individual has to decide if he is suffering or not.Originally posted by stupidissmart:I am puzzled by tis explanation. God gives the punishment, the punishment is suffering. (tat particular) Punishment=suffering. Now u telling me they r not the same thing. Wat is the technical difference between these 2 ?
I am diabetic.... but am I suffering? Sure, from the figure of speech, it can be said that "I am suffering from a disease", but in my own mind, I am not suffering. I only happen to have a disease and have come to terms with it and take care of my diet so that this disease to not worsen. But am I suffering, of course not.
Punishment.... say I am not happy with my son's results and I punish him by not allowing him to watch TV. In the meantime, he finds other things to do... did he suffer? No.....!
I am sure you'd say that my explanation is probably too simplistic, it probably is, but all I am trying to do is to differentiate the issues between punishment and suffering.
Ok, putting it this way is not too incorrect. But let's take a step back, we cut ourself, we bleed. So we can also say that God created the bleeding. Or if I spill my coffee now, I'd screw up my keyboard, and again hold God responsible for my damaged laptop.... it this a fair game?Originally posted by stupidissmart:Suffering, if u follow genesis, did follow from disobedience. However technically the creator of suffering is still god, who implement it as suffering to the people. It is not men who have the power to create suffering and worse still implement it on themselves
Yup, God created the whole infrastructure of spaceship earth. He created consequences, but we are responsible for the consequences, not Him.... -
Not in Singapore ar? Working overseas liao? steady lah!Originally posted by stupidissmart:Oh wow... I forgot it is 3 am in singapore already -
Aiya, no suffering, where got joy rite. Question too simple leh. Can you come up with more challenging ones?
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ahem!Originally posted by :Aiya, no suffering, where got joy rite. Question too simple leh. Can you come up with more challenging ones?
SIS, if you dont rebut you r proving your biasness on me. -
If you tell me whats wrong with what i said, i can change.Originally posted by M©+square:If God were to allow suffering to follow you for the rest of your life.
Would you accept it?
You are adopting a very ideal mindset.
yes, i hv a suffering that will follow me the rest of my life.
Not as painful as Jesus's crusification though. -
Case discussion :Originally posted by davidche:If you tell me whats wrong with what i said, i can change.
yes, i hv a suffering that will follow me the rest of my life.
Not as painful as Jesus's crusification though.
Andy have cancer. Do you think he -
1)Would have rather have cancer for the rest of your life
OR
2)to be healed and free from sufferings of cancer?
Choose.
One question - one answer.
Number 1 or 2? -
reminds me of the 2100 chinese drama big man small man.Originally posted by M©+square:Case discussion :
Andy have cancer. Do you think he -
1)Would have rather have cancer for the rest of your life
OR
2)to be healed and free from sufferings of cancer? Choose.
One question - one answer.
Number 1 or 2?
Mr Chua cannot answer MCQ .. so Patricia gave him T/F. -
Your turn to shoot and True/False qns to Davidche.Originally posted by Icemoon:reminds me of the 2100 chinese drama big man small man.
Mr Chua cannot answer MCQ .. so Patricia gave him T/F. -
believe me, T/F questions can sometimes be more difficult than MCQ
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the way they are worded might be a trap .. like how an experienced lawyer can trap a witness.Originally posted by laurence82:believe me, T/F questions can sometimes be more difficult than MCQ
All lawyers strive to lead you to the conclusion they already thought of. -
yeap
TF is focused on analysing the words that can trap you in the question
MCQ diversify the risk in the answers -
but luckily there is no rule saying you can't clarify the wording during an exam.Originally posted by laurence82:yeap
TF is focused on analysing the words that can trap you in the question
MCQ diversify the risk in the answers -
no, coz examiner/ lecturer present can say, the wording is clear liao, its whether u can see it or notOriginally posted by Icemoon:but luckily there is no rule saying you can't clarify the wording during an exam. -
Shyte, i was going to use T/F in the Omnipotent thread.
Cannot use liao -
i dont know how a person can have cancer all his life. Is his life 20 years or 70 years?Originally posted by M©+square:Case discussion :
Andy have cancer. Do you think he -
1)Would have rather have cancer for the rest of your life
OR
2)to be healed and free from sufferings of cancer? Choose.
One question - one answer.
Number 1 or 2? -
my answer is number two.Originally posted by M©+square:Case discussion :
Andy have cancer. Do you think he -
1)Would have rather have cancer for the rest of your life
OR
2)to be healed and free from sufferings of cancer? Choose.
One question - one answer.
Number 1 or 2?
Of course one he wld want to be healed. Even me during my leg condition i also wanted to be healed. But for me, God didnt do it instandtly, and i think its the process tat matters.
Verse for thought, unker chin :
11 The LORD said to him, "Who gave man his mouth? Who makes him deaf or mute? Who gives him sight or makes him blind? Is it not I, the LORD ? 12 Now go; I will help you speak and will teach you what to say." -
For the benefit of the other readers, you need to provide book and chapter as well. For the information of the other readers, the passage quoted by dave is from Exodus 4:11.Originally posted by davidche:Verse for thought, unker chin :
11 The LORD said to him, "Who gave man his mouth? Who makes him deaf or mute? Who gives him sight or makes him blind? Is it not I, the LORD ? 12 Now go; I will help you speak and will teach you what to say."
The context of the verse is when God told Moses to go and have his chat with the Pharaoh. God is telling Moses that Moses is only an instrument, and all Moses needed to do is GO. Everything else that needed to be done is done through the strength of the Lord.
Going back to the context of this thread, being deaf, mute or blind is a physical condition. It does not mean that a man that is deaf or mute or blind is SUFFERING.
My advice to you, young dave, is, when you are quoting scripture, please check the context of why it was written. Just lifting a verse out of it's original context does not do justice to the Word Of God! -
Can i know if being mute and blind is not suffering then what is it?
defeinition of suffering:
To feel pain or distress; sustain loss, injury, harm, or punishment.
To tolerate or endure evil, injury, pain, or death. See Synonyms at bear1.
To appear at a disadvantage: “He suffers by comparison with his greater contemporary” (Albert C. Baugh).
Wiki:
Suffering is any aversive (not necessarily unwanted) experience and the corresponding negative emotion. It is usually associated with pain and unhappiness, but any condition can be suffering if it is subjectively aversive. Antonyms include happiness or pleasure. -
I am not sure where you get your definition from, but the American Heritage dictionary has the following:Originally posted by davidche:Can i know if being mute and blind is not suffering then what is it?
defeinition of suffering:
To feel pain or distress; sustain loss, injury, harm, or punishment.
To tolerate or endure evil, injury, pain, or death. See Synonyms at bear1.
To appear at a disadvantage: “He suffers by comparison with his greater contemporary” (Albert C. Baugh).
Wiki:
Suffering is any aversive (not necessarily unwanted) experience and the corresponding negative emotion. It is usually associated with pain and unhappiness, but any condition can be suffering if it is subjectively aversive. Antonyms include happiness or pleasure.
The condition of one who suffers; the bearing of pain or distress.
An instance of pain or distress.
Having a condition does not make one suffer. Suffering is a state of mind. Note your definition in wiki: suffering is AN AVERSIVE EXPERIENCE... and is usually associated with pain and unhappiness... any condition can be suffering if it is subjectively aversive....
Suffering is independent from punishment and
Punishment is independent from suffering...
although in many cases, it is usually seen together, but it does not have to. -
yes indeed its a state of the mind.